A Blend of WordCamp Europe, WordPress and WooCommerce

Abha: And we’re here in the Do the Woo Studio today with a very special guest. Not only is he someone who loves e-commerce and using Woo, but also has an absolute passion for all things WordCamp Europe. Now I’m going to get him to introduce himself in a little bit, but we are going to have some very interesting stories related to WordPress, but also some cooking stories in there as well. So welcome to the studio we have today. We have Sjoerd Blom and he is joining us from the WordCamp Europe 2023 team, and he’s been speaking to myself and it’s Abha Thakor and we’re here for Do the Woo. Hello.

Sjoerd: Hello there. Hello, Abha.

Abha: It is so nice to see you and the sun is shining. The sun’s always shining when I’m talking to you. I’ve realized this now. So after being a WordCamp Europe organizer for quite a few years and working alongside you, I can’t think of a time when it’s been raining when you’ve been there. So that’s a good advert for WordCamp. You’re to start off with.

Sjoerd: Yes, I’m always the Sunshine bringing to your homes. Yes, I’d love to have fun with you. So go ahead and I’ll make you smile.

Abha: And it’s always great to have you in the studio and of course Do the Woo. This year is again a media sponsor and supporter for WordCamp Europe. And if you don’t know what WordCamp Europe is and you’re listening to this, then you need to get on their site and find out. And it’s Europe.WordCamp.org/2023. And if you haven’t got your ticket yet, are there tickets left or is it now waiting for next year?

Sjoerd: No, there’s still tickets left. Yes.

Abha: There’s still tickets left. So get onto that site if you haven’t got one yet. Also, while we know people have been looking at this, will they also be tickets contribute today still available or are they now fully booked? I know it’s been very popular.

Sjoerd: It is very popular, but there’s still tickets available. Yes. So please go ahead and register.

Abha: Now as someone who’s been working in the WordPress space for quite a while, how many years have you been doing WordCamp Europe now?

Sjoerd: WordCamp Europe, the first time it started I think it was, oh, it was in Vienna. It was actually my first time I even volunteered for a WordCamp. So I was just drawn towards Vienna and I was surprised and I was charmed by the lovely and warm community that is, well the WordPress community. Great. So that’s where it started. And yeah, I started to volunteer later on first as a volunteer and then it was an organizer that was, I think it was Berlin was the first time.

Abha: So I think Berlin was my first WordCamp organizing thing too. So that was great place to be. And you talk about you were drawn to the community. Is WordCamp Europe something that is just incredibly special that if people haven’t experienced it yet, either as a volunteer or organizer or attendee, it’s something they need to do?

Sjoerd: It is special in a kind of way that there are people coming from all kinds of cultures, all countries, and that makes it very good to just see and meet because normally you just get to meet each other online and now this is a very good excuse to go and see each other in real life. And that’s what WordCamp Europe also is about. That’s track actually the hallway track we call it, where you go and see and hug everyone and have chats and talk about things and drink your coffee, drink some water and laugh.

Abha: It is the place to be smiling, isn’t it? And to meet everybody that you’ve been talking to online to haven’t met in person, but also to make new friends and to start lifelong acquaintances as well. So this year Europe got a even more important role on WordCamp Europe. Can you tell us a little bit about what you’re doing this year?

Sjoerd: This year I’m the global lead, one of the three global leads of WordCamp Europe. So I have the main responsibility for all the teams and team leads. So the structure is actually, we have teams existing of seven, maybe 10 people led by team leads. And these team leads are supervised by the global leads. So my responsibility are a couple of teams. So we have a focus team, we focus on a couple of teams. I focus on design team, the communications and PR team and photography team that’s also on the IT team. So these are my controlled areas.

Abha: I know we’ve worked together before on the communications team for WordCamp Europe. That is a really important part of connecting back to the community. If people are listening to this and thinking, okay, well I haven’t been before and I’d like to go, where are the places they can get the key information?

Sjoerd: On the websites, of course. It’s the most important place to acquire all the information so you can find anything from the schedule, latest post, the speaker info, the organizers info, and also the context form and very important, the code of conduct that we have for our community. And if you’re not into websites, there are people who are not into websites, but still you can use social media. We have Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, and we’re also peeking towards Mastodon at the moment.

Abha: So really you’re out there, you’ve just got to put WordCamp Europe into that search engine of your choice and you’ll find out all about this wonderful event, which is one of the biggest in the world. And how many people are you expecting this year?

Sjoerd: We hope to see around 2,500 or maybe if ticket sales go even peak towards 3,000, but we need a little more sales for other tickets.

Abha: So you’ve heard the man you need to get up on your tickets and get it booked because this is a place that you will want to be. Can you tell us a little bit more about the choice of venue this time and the location so people know what amazing place it’s going to be to visit?

Sjoerd: Yeah. Okay. The choice of the venue, it’s in the Megaron conference hall in Athens in Greece. It’s a very lovely place. It is situated not far away from the old ancient city. If you check the website, the Megaron, it is interesting. It’s below ground level mostly. So it is nice and cool because Athens can be very hot in June. And if you like to spend some time outside, we have also this year some activities and some facilities outdoors, covered hopefully to cover protect us from the sun because it can be, like I said, it can be hot and just either you are inside and enjoy the event or just spend some time in the garden or in the park next door and chat with the other people through the community.

Abha: Mentioning of parks, WordCamp Europe I know takes sustainability very as a key thing. And for those who haven’t come across it yet, there is now a group on Make that is focusing on sustainability and working towards being a team. And I know from working at WordCamp Europe as an organizer, it was one of the things that really was special to me and was something that we hoped we could help other people with. This year, are there any special sustainability things that you’ve got into place?

Sjoerd: Yes, we have a number of sustainability topics that we are working on and we’re just working on another publication of all the things we do. We’ve asked the sponsors to make their goodies as sustainable as possible. So it could be digital goodies, goodie bags that we have seen for instance, for WordCamp Europe online. It could also be something like food for instance. So we have the catering, we were looking to that make that more sustainable, use sustainable products and recycle as much as possible. So we’re working on that and there are more things even at my level, I don’t know all the details on what they have worked out, but there are options and there are many just technical suggestions and we’re working on them.

Abha: And I know we do, we’re going to be highlighting much more about what’s happening at WordCamp Europe. So if you’re listening and you’re attending and you’ve got a sustainable travel journey that you could share that we can also share with the new sustainability group, then that would be fantastic. So I know in previous years at WordCamp Europe you’ve had a lot of opportunities for people just to take a break to be able to share with each other, to learn from each other and not just in the hallway track but also just in other areas. Is that something you’ve got planned again this year?

Sjoerd: Yes, we have a plan again this year, so it’ll be an option for you. Yeah, absolutely.

Abha: And I know the famous after party may still be secret or are you able to tell us a little bit more about what people can expect?

Sjoerd: People can expect a very special location, expect something which is quite unique. So just wait and see and you’ll be able to join the party.

Abha: So these are the dates for your diary if they’re not already there, it’s the ninth and the 10th of June, which is 2023 WordCamp Europe conference days. And also they contribute today. Find out how you can make a difference to this open source software on the 8th of June, all in the same location areas. So if you are there, you’ll have a chance to get to know where and meet people and these events, I’m sure you’ll agree are for everybody, all skills and levels of experience it is just get your ticket and you’ll not be lonely when you arrive at the event.

Sjoerd: That’s great. Today is the place to be. A special work in Europe because it’ll help you meet new people, just sit around on the table and do things, work on e-commerce, work on documentation, translation, et cetera. It is actually the place to get in touch with the newer people, newer friends of your community.

Abha: It is, and as a core team organizer and team rep this year that we’ll have tables from core, we’ll have tables from all of the teams that you would expect to see there that make up WordPress. So do go ahead and take part in that contributor today. And if you’ve never started before, there’s lots of help to do. So in WordCamp Europe is one of the best places to start contributing and having run that team and been involved with it for a few years. I can vouch from both sides of the table that it’s a great experience.

I’m going to take you now to a little bit more about yourself and to inspire people into not only volunteering to be a WordCamp organizer in the future, but also to work and contribute to WordPress. Now you call yourself an early adopter of WordPress, discovering it in 2006, but one of the most intriguing things I’ve read and I’m talking to you is that what made you make the shift to WordPress was finding out that code was poetry and that it really was. Can you tell us a little bit more about how you see code and why for you WordPress just gives you that something special?

Sjoerd: Yeah, that’s an interesting question. Yeah. The phrase triggered by code is poetry is I was in those days working with another blogging tool. I was working, I forgot the name of it, and I just needed something to change the code and it was not possible in that code because it was quite close sourced. But I just came along WordPress and I looked at it and said, okay, it’s just blogging. What can you do with just a blogging tool? But it said, code is poetry. That triggered me and it turned out that it had the options of installing plugins. Aha. That was the reason for me to shift to WordPress because I could change the concept of one editing tool into a tool that I could use for my own good. And so I made a shift and I had to move all the content over to WordPress. And when I had that done, a new world unfolds, it was great. So it was a good step and I didn’t realize what things had in future for me now. So it just changed my life.

Abha: And change your life is something that we hear a lot in WordPress as one of their contributors to the people of WordPress series and also for WordCamp Europe, writing about contributors. The amazing stories that you hear are what really help you make you want to carry on. I know I remember my first WordCamp in Europe, which is my first to attend, and this lovely chap came up to me, I think it must been my second day, and I was still feeling a little bit lost and introduced himself and said, “Hey, do you know where everything is? Do you want any help? Is there anything that you’re not sure about? And also, how can I make it better for you?” And of course the person was understandably yourself and it had such an amazing impact because you’re there surrounded by thousands of people you do not necessarily know in an environment that you may not know.

And if you have, and I hear people say this a lot, if they have any kind of worries or accessibility issues, having someone come up and just help and put a hand out and go, okay, how can I help? It just makes such a difference. And I think that’s also part of how code is poetry because for me poetry is about bringing people together and I think WordPress definitely does that. And just really want to see how you would encourage people who’ve never made that jump to WordPress or to WooCommerce, what would you say to them based on your experience and this community that we are part of?

Sjoerd: I would tell them just come along and have a look at it. If you want, try a new car, for instance, you want to buy a new car and you make a test ride. So I’ll tell them, just come along, make a test drive with me. You will see it is really poetry what’s going on here. Make some crazy tours, drive around the countryside, talk about things, have a drink, sit over there, have a drink over there, et cetera. And didn’t return to the car sales station and say, okay, what do you think? Shall we make the move? Yes or no? Usually people will say yes. And that’s also how I use, I work with my customers, I give them a try, just a free trial and my positive attitude convinces them to make the oath. Yes, it works really.

Abha: I love the car analogies and I can remember our wonderful conversations about that. And I think that’s a thing for anyone who’s not experienced WordPress or the community before and especially WordCamp Europe, is that if you have an interest in a particular area outside coding, the chances are you’ll find somebody who does too. I’ve sat at WordPress events and learnt a new knitting stitch. I’ve talked about car engines. I’ve organized going on very, very weird and wonderful adventures. But also I’ve learned a lot about code. I’ve learned a lot about, okay, this is a thing I can’t do in PHP, why can’t I do it? What is it that I’m missing? And just somebody going, actually it’s just this backslash. It’s just, it’s worth its weight in gold and it’s a great thing to do. You talked about working with your own customers, now you’re based in the Netherlands?

Sjoerd: That’s correct, yeah.

Abha: But you always been based there or where else have you?

Sjoerd: I’ve been based in the Netherlands. I have customers not only in the Netherlands, in Belgium and Germany as well, but yeah, I have, that’s the fun of internet and the world, you can have customers anywhere. I recently moved to the northern parts of the Netherlands. It was four years ago already, but my larger customer base is more in the center of the Netherlands, but they’re still my customers. So it doesn’t matter where you live, you just can have customers anywhere and they can have any age, they can have any knowledge.

I have housewives, one you were talking about knitting. I have a housewife and she has this knitting website on that she hosts and she has all kinds of, what do you call those figures of how to plants make these nice cardigans, scarfs, et cetera with all the prints in it. And it’s the entire schedule that you need to knit something. It’s lovely. And she has that and she’s running a website on that in WordPress and she’s selling those instructions as PDFs on the website and she just makes some money just for fun. And she’s 55 years old and she’s having so much fun. She says it’s so easy, you can do it.

Abha: And that’s the thing, isn’t it about e-commerce? It doesn’t have to be complicated, it doesn’t have to be confusing. It could be your passion project, it could also be your big business, your small side project, whatever you want to make it. When did you first move to doing e-commerce?

Sjoerd : I think it was about seven, eight years ago. It was because there was a request from customers on how to work with, there was WooCommerce at that time and it was a website with judo and Ikea, they were selling weapons and judo shoots. So it was the first time and he said, okay, I want to sell them. How can I sell these? Okay, try WooCommerce. I made a nice website for him in nice white and black color, some red typical Asian we think. And he sells it to his local clients. Works great.

Thanks to GoDaddy for their support

Abha: And I think one of the questions I always ask people who come on our shows is, what is the most fascinating WooCommerce website or WordPress website that’s e-commerce related that you’ve built that has just made you feel that it’s a wonderful time for commerce?

Sjoerd: I have a WooCommerce website and it’s in the front side, so it’s entirely WooCommerce, but in the backside it has a database run by ExecOnline that’s used for a food business. And what this website is made of is a community of local farmers that sell their goods through a local agent and this agent is running the website for them and stores all the data in their database and then pushes it to the WooCommerce and it makes a beautiful website. I made this concept together with them and we copy the concept for multiple townships. So we have one in the city of Eindhoven. We have one in the city of Tillburg, which are city is just in the southern part of Netherlands. So the concept is the same, but only the styling is different. And it’s a format that we developed and it’s a very well working concept. Great. It’s quite large.

Abha: And you also work with translations and I think you’re a polyglot as well translating things into Dutch on WordPress.

Sjoerd: I’ve been doing that until I started to organize WordCamp, then I just paused that part. But I hope to join the polyglot team again after I have organized the WordCamp Europe. This is my last time I’m organizing WordCamp Europe and manage. There is an unwritten rule in WordCamp, WordCamp land where you can’t be an organizer for two years in a row. Global leads is only one time. But then yeah, I have more time to do other things in the WordCamp WordPress community.

Abha: So look out for you in WordPress Translation Day then later this year. In terms of that translation aspect though, and because obviously you’ve worked on WordCamp Netherlands as well in the past and with your clients with some element of translation, going back to WordCamp Europe, obviously most of the talks are in English, but people can access them after the event in other languages, can’t they, through subtitling?

Sjoerd: No, they’re not. Maybe we could do that with AI. It would be nice.

Abha: So the talks on WordPress TV can be subtitled.

Sjoerd: They can be subtitled. Yes.

Abha: And that subtitling allows other communities to also translate those talks.

Sjoerd: Yeah, that’s the everything, but then you have to hand make the translations yourself. That’s true. One of the options. It’s not done by us, but it’s done by the community. Yes, that’s correct.

Abha: And we’ve seen some with WordPress translation over the years where key talks have actually been translated by lots of different locales as well and they use the subtitles that WordCamp Europe upload to help them do that. And it’s just one of the examples of how WordCamp Europe really is that global event and it is about connecting people regardless of where they are.

Sjoerd: Absolutely. It’s a fun thing of the global community.

Abha: Absolutely. Now you’ve got two and a half thousand people coming to Greece for this event in June. How do people recognize each other? Will there be t-shirts this year of attendees or how are you doing that?

Sjoerd: Okay, people will recognize just because they have lanyards, they get the tickets, of course they will be able to recognize each other. Names will be printed on the label and there are t-shirts available. You can just sign up when you buy a ticket if you want to have a t-shirt and what size. So if you don’t want to have a t-shirt, it’s fine. It’s also very sustainable not to have a t-shirt. That’s one of the things I like, but there are still people who want to have t-shirts so they can get one and we have very nice colors this year. Of course it’s always with blue and white. This typically Greek, this t-shirt will also have those scholars and they will be different from the organizers and volunteers will have, they’re different color, but the prints, you have seen the website, we have a lovely design made by Lena Leko from Greece and her team. They have designed another great t-shirt this year. I’ll be proud to wear it.

Abha: The t-shirts are always great and the pink, especially a few years ago was a really lovely color. So for those people who’ve not seen it already who are just joining, listening to this it’s europe.wordcamp.org/2023 and the beauty of WordCamp web addresses now is that the main bit stays the same. So once the WordCamp is over, you can just change the date to 2024 when the new website is up and you’ll be diverted to see where you can join next year.

Sjoerd: Yeah. Okay. Just one addition to that one, there is a smart setup in the URL on the website, so if you just type without the year, you will be redirected to the latest version.

Abha: Even better.

Sjoerd: Keep it short. Europe.WordCamp.org. That’s it.

Abha: And of course you’re also on Twitter as well.

Sjoerd: That’s correct. WCEurope.

Abha: And on Facebook and on… So that’s WCEurope on Twitter and you’re on Facebook.

Sjoerd: Correct. That’s also, and you can find the links to the website.

Abha: And for anyone just wanting to look on their phones while listening to this, it’s WC Europe for Facebook as well and there’s an Instagram channel as well. So there’s no excuse not be able to follow the wonderful news that is happening with WordCamp Europe. You’ve also got, and I’m really pleased to see this having been involved with the Wellness Track before, you have Wellness Track again this year. Can you tell us a bit more about that?

Sjoerd: Okay, the Wellness Track is again, yeah, it’s something to do outside and just to relax and it will involve yoga mats again this year.

Abha: I had the great delight of photographing the yoga a couple of years ago and we did a witness at WordCamp Europe and we managed to get some of the global leads to come and do yoga. So at that time, while the global leads didn’t tell us that he was an expert in yoga, but we got some cracking photos. So will you be trying out the yoga this year?

Sjoerd: I might try it, yes. I think it will be busy, but it’s something I would like to try and I would love to try it. Okay, I’ll do it.

Abha: Well, that means next time we interview you we’ll have to see how you found it. So you also got Tai Chi this year and a couple of other things that are available as well. And I think you can book all those things. All the details are on the website. Now are all the speakers now announced?

Sjoerd: I think there are a few more coming up. Yeah.

Abha: So there’s more excitement to come and of course it is in a world-class location this year in the center of Athens. And you were telling me before we went on air today that there’s so many historical landmarks just within a short walk away.

Sjoerd: Correct. There were actually we have the metro station just in front of the Megaron so that in front of the venue. Anyway, take just two metro stops and you’re in the square where you can have the change of the guards every hour. Just make sure you just don’t miss it. My advisors go there at 8:00 AM or 7:00 AM otherwise it’s two hot. There are things as well. Just make sure you just join one of the tours that is available in Athens. Visit the Acropolis by preference 7:00 AM also or 8:00 AM. It is open very early in the morning just because with temperatures and it’s all one big museum, you are walking around in Athens, it’s lovely.

Abha: And of course if you go to those places at that time of day, you’ve got even more time to spend at WordCamp Europe, meeting some wonderful people. And Bob from our wonderful Do the Woo, Bob is going to be at WordCamp Europe this year, so make sure you look out for him and we’d love to see lots and lots of selfies with people with Bob and telling us how much you love Do the Woo, but also why you love being part of this community. Because that’s what it’s all about, sharing together and just having a really great time and making people feel welcome. And I know that you and your team are going to do just that. Making everybody who comes feel welcome and helping us as a wider community actually work better and find ways to make code even more useful. This year is a very special year for WordPress of course because it is the 20th anniversary coming up this month. Is there anything that you’re doing for WordCamp Europe to celebrate or mark that 20th anniversary?

Sjoerd: We have something special in common with the T-shirts.

Abha: Ooh.

Sjoerd: There will be something special added to the t-shirts. Make sure you get one. Unfortunately we won’t have the team from the US coming over selling the WordPress start this time and that’s a pity. Hopefully they will be able to join us next year. Otherwise, we would have lovely swag with a WP20 prints on it.

Abha: Do you have a Wapuu this year?

Sjoerd: We have a Wapuu. It hasn’t been revealed yet. We had to select multiple choose from multiple Wapuus and the one we chose is typically Greek. Yeah, it is part of Greece.

Abha: I’m so looking forward to seeing this now. But if you want to see the Wapuu as well or exchange Wapuu stickers, which is a very common thing by the way at WordPress. And I was delighted to see this year at WordCamp Asia, I had to see a lot of people. We managed to get exchanging WordPress and WordCamp T-shirts in a sustainable manner because they weren’t sent in across airplanes. They were sent with people who were already going. So there was a nice exchange going on of those two. So another reason of course to go to WordCamp Europe this time. Is there a cutoff when people need to have bought their ticket?

Sjoerd: No, we just have a milestone date because we need to book our catering of course, but ticket sales will go on until the day itself. So make sure you get with some and then get your tickets. If not, okay, you can try and show up in Athens and see if we can book tickets at the gates. It’s not what we want to do, but just pre-book them and you are sure that you will have access to all the foods and also the fun after party.

Abha: Yeah. And book your contribute today as well so that the team know exactly how many are going to be there and it makes it a lot easier because they’re all volunteers on the team and it makes it easier for them. You also got an even bigger push this year on accessibility and inclusivity, which is really good to see. And for anybody wanting to go to WordCamp Europe and has concerns about any of this, there is now a dedicated page. So if you go to the website and then you can click on the accessibility and inclusivity link, it will show you the accessible venue for the map, accessible transport in Athens. If you’re hard of hearing or you’re partially sighted, for attendees who’ve got autism, there’s lots of information available and I think that’s really important. And I know that so Sjoerd, you’ll echo that in your feelings about how and why WordCamp Europe needs to be inclusive.

Sjoerd: I think it’s very important to be inclusive. Just Europe is very diverse and we have not only in cultural background but also in physical differences. All these people just need to feel safe over there and be able to join whatever they want to do. We have the subscription service, but people just have the subtitling. People use that not only just because they have an hearing problem, but also for people who just don’t understand English that very well. It’s very useful. So even inclusivity and my pronunciation, I’m Dutch, so sometimes I just struggle to pronounce some words anyway. Even for those people have issues with understanding is properly this will work. So even inclusivity is also available to them as well. So yes, we want to join, want people to join us and be part of our community. Absolutely.

Abha: And if you see something and you think actually this could make it better next year, then the best thing is to go and suggest it and even better be part of it. And that’s how WordCamps get better and better. Now I have a challenge for you and for our listeners today. So I’m working on a cookery linked show and I know that you have a passion for cooking as well.

Sjoerd: That’s correct. My side job is also I’m a cook, professional cook.

Abha: Which has always fascinated me. And you still do that today as well. So what kind of cook do you specialize, or cookery do you specialize in?

Sjoerd: For me as a professional cook, anything. So I have large catering and normally I just work on a live cooking event. So I work in a restaurant of a huge hotel. This morning I got up at 4:30 just to serve breakfast for our hotel guests. So it’s quite broad in the way we are and we serve the food. So my specialty is live cooking. So you just order and I’ll make it.

Abha: Oh fantastic. Now I’m going to get you to pledge that you’re going to come back and do something with us for our cookery series as well. And also maybe you’ll get some inspiration from while you’re at WordCamp Europe in Greece and bring us something back, a tip or some pictures, a couple of pictures of things that you might come on with us and cook. Well and we’ve been working on, we’re going to be talking code at the same time. So while things are boiling, while things… Well, we’re chopping, obviously taking care of our fingers, just taking and having a bit of a chat about how things work in WordPress and Woo as well. So do you think we can enlist you onto that show in the future?

Sjoerd: Absolutely. I’d love to be there.

Abha: And we look forward to your pictures of food as well. And I have heard from a couple of other people from Netherlands that they’re going to dance while they cook. So I will leave you to decide whether you want to do that or you are just quite happy just talking code and poetry and one person says they’re going to play the piano in between while the food is boiling. So that’s going to be interesting.

Sjoerd: People dancing and playing the piano while they’re cooking. Sorry, there’s no attention to the food. So I doubt the quality is that good.

Abha: Well, we can make sure the health and safety is followed, but I think the idea is to have a bit of fun, but also to help people cook better and to be more familiar with different things. But also being part of outside your comfort zone is a great way to making sure that we’re all not overworking and burning out. And it’s a great way to find and explore ideas together without any pressure because it’s something to do at the same time. So we’ll be looking forward to hearing all about WordCamp Europe after, and of course as Do the Woo is a media partner this year we’ll be dropping in and interviewing people. Bob will be there in person. So please make sure you give Bob a wave. And I hope we’ll get a picture of you two together at WordCamp Europe so that we can increase that and increase the use of all of our images from there as well.

And it just leaves me to say good luck. It’s going to be fabulous, I’m sure. And I know if you know are one of the people that made WordCamp Europe special for me, made it easier and less scary. And if anyone’s still worried about going to such a big, big event, don’t be. Our guest here today is on the global leads and all the team are amazing. Get on that website, Europe.WordCamp.org and get your ticket. See you in WordCamp Europe, tell us how much you enjoy it. Tell us how you love e-commerce and even more if there’s something that you have a story that you can tell us about, interesting about how you became a developer involved with Woo, make sure you let Bob know or let me know and we’ll make sure we’ll feature it at some point too in the coming year.

Thank you so much for being with us, especially as you woke up nearly 12 hours ago, if not more to work. And we’re so grateful that you made the time. Big hug to you all. I look forward to seeing the Wapuu. I’m hoping someone’s going to save me a t-shirt and we’ll look forward to seeing you again, but just tell people where they can find you online and connect with you.

Sjoerd: Okay, thank you very much for your kind words, Abha. It’s great. And I love being on the Do the Woo podcast. So where you can find me is just to check out my website vertizio.nl and it’ll be in the bio link of course. And also you can find me on Twitter, S-J-B-L-O-M. I’m not that very often on Twitter. Instagram is also some place where you can find me and Mastodon is currently where I’m more available. And of course WordCamp Europe, you can find me, just click the link on my bio and so you will find me there.

Abha: Absolutely. So 9th of June this year, this is the place to be. And if Bob from Do the Woo is going to be there, then you really need to be at WordCamp Europe. Join our wonderful global lead today and all the other organizers from many, many countries over the world. We look forward to seeing you. We’ll be thinking of you and good luck.

Sjoerd: Thank you very much.